Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

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BobC
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Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:09 am

Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by BobC » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:08 am

I'm in the process of adding either a Helix 10SI or Helix 12 Chirp SI unit to my dash on a Cobia 24' center console. I already have an 1198c SI and radar. I want the unit for duplication, redundancy and convenience of watching 2 full screens. I fish blue water up to 50mi offshore, generally wreck fishing and want a backup system to get me home, just in case.

I have a couple of questions to guide me on setup. In essence, I will use the new Helix as my primary for navigation and scanning and the 1198 as backup and radar display when running blue water during darkness. When I'm wreck fishing, I will use the Helix for DI/SI scanning and have the 1198 for navigation.

1. According to the HB website, the transducer XHS9HDSI 180T is the same for my 4 year old 1198cSI and the new Helix units. If that's the case, I will probably mount the new ducer that comes with the Helix on the opposite side of the 300 YAM and run 1 ducer at a time to eliminate any interference. 1198cSI is only side imaging/traditional while the Helix is SI/DI and traditional. Does that make since or is there a better way to setup? The 2 ducers would be about 3' apart with the outboard in the middle.

2. I have a HB 21" radar to my HB 1198 unit. Is there a way to use a Y cable to I can have the ability to view radar on by units at the same time? I thought I could ethernet both units although if I remember the radar plugs into the 1198 where the ethernet cable would go. I could be mistaken, seeing a diagram of where to plug what in is appreciated. If a Y cable will work, what is the part #?

3. My 1198cSI has an ASGR50 external GPS puck. The Helix will accept either AS GPS HS (+compass) or the AS GRHA external. Can the 1198cSI and the Helix be operated off the same external GPS or are there differences and I should install a separate external antenna to the Helix? While some folks may say the Helix has an internal antenna, I have a center console, with a hard top, 2 guys huddled around the unit plus lots of "stuff" on the console top.... I imagine there may interfere with an internal antenna's reception.

4. Are there written procedures for downloading all my way point marks from my 1198cSI and transfer them to the new Helix?

Thanks for all the assistance.
BobC

Wayne P.
Posts: 1613
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:24 pm

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by Wayne P. » Sun Jan 31, 2016 2:43 pm

I have read all you post and don't have a definitive answer for all it yet since I don't have any Helix models to experiment with.

I do know that in question #1 you are incorrect about SI and DI between the two units. ALL Side Imaging units except the ONIX and ION use the exact same transducer and they do not have a dedicated DI crystal. The DI view is software blending of the two SI pulses.

As soon as I get the technology sharing answers, I will take care of the rest of your post. It may be a lot simpler than you anticipate.
Wayne Purdum
Charlottesville, Va.

BobC
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:09 am

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by BobC » Sun Jan 31, 2016 3:37 pm

Thanks Wayne, I like simple. I didn't realize the side imagining units used software blending to create the DI imagine. I thought it was a dedicated crystal. Learned something new today, only the Onix and Ion are imaged from DI crystal in the ducer! I wonder if the Garmin products which advertise 'DownVu" are also software blends of side images.
Bob

Wayne P.
Posts: 1613
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:24 pm

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by Wayne P. » Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:23 pm

Only Humminbird does that.
Humminbird put Side Imaging on the market (about 2004) several years before Lowrance copied it and then Raymarine copied it and recently Garmin copied it.
In Jan. 2010 Humminbird released a software that blended the two SI pulses to create the Down Imaging view. That gave every Side Imaging unit from the very first one that view with no hardware changes. That blended SI is still in use.

When the others came out with their versions, they included a down looking imaging crystal in their imaging transducer.

Lowrance's copy was a transducer that did Side Scan and Down Scan, but no 2D sonar. You purchase a 2D unit and add the imaging transducer accessory to have all three technologies.

Garmin has a transducer that does all three technologies like the ONIX SI transducer. Lowrance thought it was a good idea, so this year they are coming out with a transducer that does all three also ( Total Scan ).

If you are not aware of the history of the imaging technology you would think each brand introduced some great new stuff, but in reality they all have copied Humminbird.
Wayne Purdum
Charlottesville, Va.

BobC
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:09 am

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by BobC » Mon Feb 01, 2016 7:47 pm

Thanks Wayne, copy and paste is the best form of flattery, change it just enough not to violate copyrights and you have new product with little research cost.

If you ask Navico, Garmin copied their design.

HB reps told me if I go with the ION SI and want the DI or any other ducer I have to add the SME3000 which adds yet another $2K. I mean really, the Garmin 7610xsv is comparable cost or cheaper and with a much wider selection of ducers.

I'm still between the Garmin, Simrad and the Helix 10 or 12. I'm so used to the BH operating system and like it. I don't know if I want to change. Helix has what I want, without all the new touch screen blink and ching.

Wayne P.
Posts: 1613
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:24 pm

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by Wayne P. » Mon Feb 01, 2016 8:10 pm

Would not be surprised if Lowrance gets sued for their Total Scan transducer unless there was some backdoor dealing to avoid it.

You got your models confused. The ION is like the Simrad and is modular for the blue water market. You purchase the display and then add parts to give you the data you want.

Nowhere close to the Helix and 1198.

BTW, saw earlier today that a dealer had a couple of Helix 12 SI GPS CHIRP units in stock. They sold out quick.
Wayne Purdum
Charlottesville, Va.

BobC
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:09 am

Re: Advise adding a Helix 10si or Helix 12 Chirp SI along with my 1198C SI

Post by BobC » Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:03 pm

I'm trying not to let the shiny lures catch the fisherman. Lots to choose from, just need to define 85% of my needs and stick to it....

Like my wife said last night when I was explaining options that spanned the price range from $2,000 to $5,000....."its not like you don't already catch a lot fish". I had to smile and just walk away.......no argument there.

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